Time to bust out the current event tomatoes…
You may have heard about this case as the polygamist sect, or even the polygamist cult case. I am really frustrated with the hypocritical way that this is portrayed in the media. Their lifestyle is obviously strange by American standards, but what happened to freedom of religion? What right does anyone have to judge these people on their beliefs? I have news or you, Jedeo-Christian America: your religious beliefs are just as ridiculous to me as theirs are to you. Celibacy of priesthood? Modestly rules? Eat this animal, but not that one? Soot on your forehead? Using an implement of torture as your primary religious symbol? Must I go on?
Whatever happened to, “Judge not, lest ye be judged?”
Look, I am not advocating their lifestyle. I think that it is controlling and suppressive, but the key is that they choose that lifestyle. They follow their beliefs (if you really look at them, they are likely to be pretty similar to your own). What I am saying is that I am tired of people dismissing them, like as I heard on CNN today where one of the talking heads said that the women are “clearly brainwashed”. Oh ya? Why is that? Because their invisible father figure with the white beard is a little different than yours? Is it because they reject your lifestyle as corrupt? Or is it simply that their lifestyle is different, and your mind is too inflexible to understand how a rational person can choose to live that way with out being deficient in some way?
My only beef with this case is the instances where children were “married” when under the age of 16. (Note, that I put that in quotes, as someone under the age of 16 is not legally allowed to marry, nor engage in sex acts.) Kids that age are not capable of making decisions like that. They do not understand commitment, nor even romantic love. That being said, I don’t think that anything malicious was going on either. The 16 restriction is relatively new. It wasn’t too long ago when we were allowing people to marry at that age, but our standards have changed (I think for the better), but because our standards have changed there is a conflict.
As a result, there is the way that I think that this case should be handled. First, all of the children should be documented, and be given birth certificates. Secondly, all children should be returned to their families; if that means that they have 4 mothers and 14 siblings, then so be it. Third, all charges and proceedings should be dropped/dismissed. Fourth, the leaders of the group, and the families, must agree to not allow children under the age of 16 to marry nor engage in any kind of sexual behavior. Fifth, all children born should be given birth certificates. Lastly, we leave them the hell alone.
I would say that all of the marriages that have taken place should be recognized, but I know that that isn’t going to happen. I doubt that the co-called victims in this case feel victimized, so it is pretty pointless to try to try to go after every instance of someone marrying before they are 16, but they also need to realize that while they are in America, and more specifically Texas, they need to adhere to the laws of the land. I think that this would be a good compromise. They can go back to their sequestered life, and we can rest assured that the children are not being abused.
Once again, this is America, where we are supposed to respect the differences in each other’s lifestyles, and whenever we dismiss these people as crazy, or as some cult, we are only hurting ourselves. Everyone has the right to live their lives as they want, so long as it is not infringing on the rights of others. As a reminder, you do not have the right to not be offended. You do not have the right to expect everyone to share your beliefs. You do not have the right to harass and persecute those who you think are strange.
Do not dismiss these people as crazy, nor their religion of these people as a cult. To me, your beliefs make just as little sense, and your religion is as likely as corrupt.
*splat*
You may have heard about this case as the polygamist sect, or even the polygamist cult case. I am really frustrated with the hypocritical way that this is portrayed in the media. Their lifestyle is obviously strange by American standards, but what happened to freedom of religion? What right does anyone have to judge these people on their beliefs? I have news or you, Jedeo-Christian America: your religious beliefs are just as ridiculous to me as theirs are to you. Celibacy of priesthood? Modestly rules? Eat this animal, but not that one? Soot on your forehead? Using an implement of torture as your primary religious symbol? Must I go on?
Whatever happened to, “Judge not, lest ye be judged?”
Look, I am not advocating their lifestyle. I think that it is controlling and suppressive, but the key is that they choose that lifestyle. They follow their beliefs (if you really look at them, they are likely to be pretty similar to your own). What I am saying is that I am tired of people dismissing them, like as I heard on CNN today where one of the talking heads said that the women are “clearly brainwashed”. Oh ya? Why is that? Because their invisible father figure with the white beard is a little different than yours? Is it because they reject your lifestyle as corrupt? Or is it simply that their lifestyle is different, and your mind is too inflexible to understand how a rational person can choose to live that way with out being deficient in some way?
My only beef with this case is the instances where children were “married” when under the age of 16. (Note, that I put that in quotes, as someone under the age of 16 is not legally allowed to marry, nor engage in sex acts.) Kids that age are not capable of making decisions like that. They do not understand commitment, nor even romantic love. That being said, I don’t think that anything malicious was going on either. The 16 restriction is relatively new. It wasn’t too long ago when we were allowing people to marry at that age, but our standards have changed (I think for the better), but because our standards have changed there is a conflict.
As a result, there is the way that I think that this case should be handled. First, all of the children should be documented, and be given birth certificates. Secondly, all children should be returned to their families; if that means that they have 4 mothers and 14 siblings, then so be it. Third, all charges and proceedings should be dropped/dismissed. Fourth, the leaders of the group, and the families, must agree to not allow children under the age of 16 to marry nor engage in any kind of sexual behavior. Fifth, all children born should be given birth certificates. Lastly, we leave them the hell alone.
I would say that all of the marriages that have taken place should be recognized, but I know that that isn’t going to happen. I doubt that the co-called victims in this case feel victimized, so it is pretty pointless to try to try to go after every instance of someone marrying before they are 16, but they also need to realize that while they are in America, and more specifically Texas, they need to adhere to the laws of the land. I think that this would be a good compromise. They can go back to their sequestered life, and we can rest assured that the children are not being abused.
Once again, this is America, where we are supposed to respect the differences in each other’s lifestyles, and whenever we dismiss these people as crazy, or as some cult, we are only hurting ourselves. Everyone has the right to live their lives as they want, so long as it is not infringing on the rights of others. As a reminder, you do not have the right to not be offended. You do not have the right to expect everyone to share your beliefs. You do not have the right to harass and persecute those who you think are strange.
Do not dismiss these people as crazy, nor their religion of these people as a cult. To me, your beliefs make just as little sense, and your religion is as likely as corrupt.
*splat*
5 Comments on “FLDS Court Case”
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While I do not disagree with your assessment of how the media has embarked on a “who can be the biggest idiot” contest one must remember what the root of the actual case was: are U.S. laws meant to protect people being broken. I think in the public eye it has been turned into a case about religious differences, and your statements about Americans all thinking “we’re right and you’re wrong” is spot-on.
However this is a criminal case. The District Attorneys (or whoever files the charges) looks at things this way: Is there any allegation of laws being broken, is there evidence to support that allegation, will that evidence hold up in court and is there reasonable hope that the resources the government spends prosecuting these crimes result in that person/people having a diminished ability to commit future crimes. In this case I believe all of those criteria were met.
We do not have any right to persecute those who think differently, but they do not have any right to wall themselves off from society and declare themselves immune from local, state and Federal laws. They are Americans, living and acting on American soil and are absolutely bound by the laws of the land.
Since the big sting, or whatever you want to call it, some information has become public that was known by those investigating the case (presumably) for years. Women were being married and made to perform sex acts against their will. Multiple forms of coercion were used to prevent them from leaving or going public. Children under-age were being married and made to perform sex acts without their consent or, as you noted, a full understanding of what was happening to them. Was this the norm? Was this happening to every woman and child? My money’s on ‘no’ but one is enough to warrant a criminal investigation and as we now know, whether or not it was the norm, it certainly was not isolated.
It’s the media that has turned this into a story about religious persecution. At its root, and in the eyes of the governing body that is seeking criminal charges, it all comes down to bringing charges against those who have broken laws.
Blogger’s comment page is retarded. This page is to make a comment. Why is only 10% of the page dedicated to the comment textarea? That is all.
Posted on April 21, 2008 at 12:34 pm.
Agreed on the criminal case. Obviously, if there were laws broken, those responsible should be punished. Part of the problem is that the case is being handled in one big lump. I am *sure* that there was some criminal activity there, but only because with a population that big, there *has* to be. The key is that each case needs to be examined separately. I mean are we going to lump all drug cases together based on race? Of course not, because it is unimportant and counterproductive. Along the same lines, why don’t we detain every single Catholic priest with their whole sex scandal? The answer: Because they weren’t involved.
Grouping these people together in this case is just as wrong. The crimes of a few should mean punishment of the entire community. To separate these children from their families is likely to do more harm (collectively) than allowing them to stay with their families (or at least given visitation).
Posted on April 21, 2008 at 1:39 pm.
The government learned a little since Waco.
Posted on April 29, 2008 at 3:17 pm.
Well, as least they didn’t go in with guns blazing.
I was a little shocked with the number of pregnant children (14-17) there. I still think that this is largely an over-reaction based on lifestyle differences.
Posted on April 29, 2008 at 3:26 pm.
Oh… it gets better.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080430/ap_on_re_us/polygamist_retreat
Posted on April 30, 2008 at 1:43 pm.